High Definition Retro gaming Art

[quote:35bboa5h]If you say 200 people is unrealistic, then fine I believe you... but why does it take feature length animations made "the old way" hundreds upon hundreds of people to make over a course of 5+ years? Because they didn't have 3d, and they didn't have "bones"... everything was hand painted... frame by frame... from scratch.

3D animated movies take about that long to make too.

[quote:1zaebhkr]If you say 200 people is unrealistic, then fine I believe you... but why does it take feature length animations made "the old way" hundreds upon hundreds of people to make over a course of 5+ years? Because they didn't have 3d, and they didn't have "bones"... everything was hand painted... frame by frame... from scratch.

3D animated movies take about that long to make too.

They don't have hundreds of people working for them these days though... not animators anyway... plus, a lot of that time is rendering footage :/

~Sol

Go Render Farm........ Away!

Ahh render farms are awesome. I set one up with 30 computers at my college for a final project I got an A for Awesome.

[quote:2iatr35r]They don't have hundreds of people working for them these days though... not animators anyway... plus, a lot of that time is rendering footage :/

Since this discussion is about the art and what shows up on screen, I understand why you wouldn't count the people in finance or such, but a lot of the people are engineers and concept artists, rigging and texture artists, etc. If they're contributing to what eventually happens on screen - like writing the software to make the stuff that happens on screen possible, like fur, hair and cloth - then I really don't think they shouldn't be counted. Animators are one piece of a film. Even in 2d movies there's the animators, inbetweeners, ink & paint, background artists... Watching the credits of any 3D animated movie shows hundreds of people who're involved.

Also, the rendering happens concurrently and overnight. The film isn't finished then everyone waits to render, because not only do the movies take too long to render to do that, but then there's editing/compositing to do after the rendering's complete as well. I maintain my stance that 3D movies take as long to make. Well, good ones, anyway.

[quote:fw5m2tpt]They don't have hundreds of people working for them these days though... not animators anyway... plus, a lot of that time is rendering footage :/

Since this discussion is about the art and what shows up on screen, I understand why you wouldn't count the people in finance or such, but a lot of the people are engineers and concept artists, rigging and texture artists, etc. If they're contributing to what eventually happens on screen - like writing the software to make the stuff that happens on screen possible, like fur, hair and cloth - then I really don't think they shouldn't be counted. Animators are one piece of a film. Even in 2d movies there's the animators, inbetweeners, ink & paint, background artists... Watching the credits of any 3D animated movie shows hundreds of people who're involved.

Also, the rendering happens concurrently and overnight. The film isn't finished then everyone waits to render, because not only do the movies take too long to render to do that, but then there's editing/compositing to do after the rendering's complete as well. I maintain my stance that 3D movies take as long to make. Well, good ones, anyway.

Yeah I totally get that... I agree in fact since the level of detail that goes into some of the models is mind blowing... like Aki from Final Fantasy... what was it again? over 2 million hair strands or something insane like that? Still... rendering does consume thousands upon thousands of hours in the process, even if it is done concurrently with the progress of the project.

And yes, I realise there are more than just animators there... without everyone else the animators would just sit there with their thumbs up their asses. I guess this, if anything, reinforces my original point of my (exaggerated) 200 person team... but I was referring in context mainly to the artists and animators and not everyone else. But yes, you are right... there are certainly a large amount of people involved, behind the scenes as well, that make things like this happen.

Hell, Blizzard employ 2,700 people... so much for "never needing 200 people on a team" or whatever.

~Sol

Anyone one remembers Nirvana's 'Heart-shaped box' video clip? Maybe some of you know that this clip was first filmed in colour, than black&whiten, and after that peaple at technicolor painted each frame manualy. What i want to say is that if you have big budget for your game, you can experiment with what ever you want, do what ever you desire and maybe go hard way. But if you a small developer who is doing its game in the time betwen day job, this person have to find the most efficient and felxible way to work. And Art has nothing to do with it. For me games like Gears of War and Unreal 3 are Half Art, becasue they just over-realistic, wshich means shallow. Shadow of the colossuss and Ico on the other hand i could be able to call art, becasue of it's overall taste to each of it's elements. Weter you have multimilion budget or not, if you want catch fill to the gfx and the gameplay, it will never become even half-art. Creativity, skill and good idea, that's what creates art.

Muramasa looks awesome. I did see two 3D backgrounds though, but the regular ones looked great.

I believe the SF2HD guys didn't use bones to preserve the original look, that's why it was so expensive (and why no one would consider KOF HD).

However, building from the ground up, using bones is a no-brainer. Specially considering how it can look when used properly (props to Vanillaware).

And I believe there is still room to get creative with 2D tricks and visual styles! (judging by what I've seen you guys do in other threads)

I believe the SF2HD guys didn't use bones to preserve the original look, that's why it was so expensive (and why no one would consider KOF HD).

What are you talking about SNK is coming out with A new HD King Of The Fighter.

The King of Fighters XII in July 16, 2009.

Yes It will take time to make a HD 2d game But it won't take longer then A 3d game.

Maybe a year and a half to to two year to make. SNK Said that each character took between sixteen and seventeen months to be done by 10 designers for KOF XII. There will be 20 characters In the game. So. SoldjahBoy you were right about there having a team of 200 people to make a HD game.

I think I misunderstood the point before. To get the equivalent of what can be done with 3D in 2D is not only not realistic to get the same level of detail, it'll definitely take much longer in 2D. As long as you're not trying to get as much detail, though (since 2D movies are far less detailed with shading/textures, etc), 2D takes about the same amount of time.

What are you talking about SNK is coming out with A new HD King Of The Fighter.

The King of Fighters XII in July 16, 2009.

Holy crap you're right!

:O

I want a Metal Slug with Muramasa's graphic quality... NOW!!!!

I want a Metal Slug with Muramasa's graphic quality... NOW!!!!