forum getting mean to newcomers lately

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  • i love these forums in general. Most people are helpful. I cannot stand people talking down to "noobs".

  • In my opinion, whipping up a cap to show how to do something isn't really the best way to do things in every case - in fact, I think it could make things worse. As the proverb goes: "Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime."

    Really, quite a lot of questions boil down to the fact that person asking the question doesn't understand game logic. The first thing in learning how to make games is to understand how they work and the ability to break things down to their most basic components. When you understand what makes up something, you can start working on it and looking for ways to achieve something. At this point if you face a problem that you can't seem to solve and ask about it on the forums I'd say it's okay to answer it via a cap or comprehensive description - after all, the asker presumably knows what he wants to achieve on a basic level, just not how to do it.

    Let's take another recent example - the question "can you make teleports in Construct?" Applying some deconstruction here, you can see what "teleporting" means: moving object from point A to point B instantly. Now if we think about what things do in games in general? They move from point A to point B. In other words, if you can achieve anything where something moves from point A to point B in Construct, yes, you can have "teleporting functionality" in Construct. It doesn't take much thinking to figure something like this out - we should encourage people to think.

    So I guess the bottom line is that we should encourage newcomers to learn game logic before asking questions about how to make X in Construct, because if they don't understand game logic the answer will most likely not be of any help to them.

    Personally I don't even bother to answer topics made by people who seem to have no motivation to do anything themselves at all; maybe if no-one answered an obvious question, maybe they could think for themselves for once. I guess I'm a bit mean in that way, but honestly, even if you're new to something doesn't mean you couldn't try learning for yourself. It's not like you're going to kill yourself by doing so!

  • I agree 100% with everything Daiz just said. I'm a big supporter of people who try for themselves. You're much more likely to get help fixing something than you are making something.

    I still bust out with full examples from scratch every once in a while, if I have nothing else to do, but for the most part I think people should at least try to make what they need, even if they fail utterly. It's okay to fail, in my book. Failing teaches much better than just being handed the answer.

  • i agree aswell, but some people just seem to keep asking for things they don't need to do what they're asking, they try so hard to make the devs improve construct from what it already is, without realizing the feature would actually be two steps back.

    when i first joined these forums i remember being quite defensive and aggressive at times like alot of these users at first, and made alot of requests for funcionality similar to what ive seen in mmf, but when i finally LEARNED most everything i needed to know, i was able to understand my mistakes, and i actually took kindly to advice given to me. people should just not post massive text walls in a discussion forum about something they barely understand, and then try to say a whole bunch of problems that need fixing according to their point of view, and react negatively toward anything DISCUSSED with them.

    i really don't see much elitism at all going on our side, i see it moreso on their side, in fact i've only seen users react in this aggressive way, to users who were acting like that towards them as well. and this is hardly anything new in these forums. Anyone remember our friend from blizzard? or the original Kodu construct battle along time ago. once again, its not that its new users in general, its just a larger proportion of fiery users have posted lately.

    the user base of construct is expanding from people who were well versed in mmf and similar game making tools, who already knew programming with events, to more and more inexperienced users, who've never once used these tools. and this undoubtedly leads to a shift in the balance of the forums, because a ton of people are constantly posting these kinds of beginner things, and many more of them are taking less and less time to listen to what were telling them. im not saying all of these aggressive users fall into here (nameless poster), but it has something to do with it in the bigger picture of everything. i myself knew how to use mff and i still acted stubborn and rude when i first joined.

    We need more tutorials, sigh.

  • That may all be true, but the point is to not put on your sassyboots and stomp around the forum. Just keep your cool. If you get upset and can't post without keeping your cool, then let someone else deal with it.

    Remember, you're under no obligation to make people see your side of things. If they ignore your cool-headed and logical debate, and persist in arguing about silly stuff, just let it go. It's not like silly stuff is going to get put into Construct because you failed to convince someone that we don't actually need Blast Processing or whatever.

  • That may all be true, but the point is to not put on your sassyboots and stomp around the forum. Just keep your cool. If you get upset and can't post without keeping your cool, then let someone else deal with it.

    Remember, you're under no obligation to make people see your side of things. If they ignore your cool-headed and logical debate, and persist in arguing about silly stuff, just let it go. It's not like silly stuff is going to get put into Construct because you failed to convince someone that we don't actually need Blast Processing or whatever.

    yea thats what i at least am gonna do from now on, i have a bad habit of trying to prove im right is all, and that last part made me laugh

  • As one of the 'new guys' here (I don't even have 20 posts) I can say that to me, this is a welcoming forum. I haven't seen that many arguments here, and those I have seen, like the recent thread of dread, are still pretty low on the flamewar scale.

    There will always be people coming in with little to no experience or misconceptions about certain things. If they're wrong, or you don't agree with them, tell them so in a calm and civil manner. They will either see your point (whether they agree or not), or flip out.

    If both parties flip out, it's no longer a discussion, it's a debate. And in a non-scientific debate (i.e. not trying to prove or disprove a scientific theory, but rather trying to impose your own ideas and values onto someone else) no one wins.

  • as i am also one of the new guys, i agree to inkBot and i am trying to fit in as easliy as possible, honestly i too had misconceptions about construct but Lost My Keys cleared them and then i realized that i was wrong, as a novice without much research i thought construct was a point and click tool, but now i am experimenting more with construct exploring the possibilities.As a new member i will try to be as polite as possible and try not to make people fired up...

    As for flamewars we cannot totally stop them, but prevent them if we see that they are going to happen in some thread.

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  • I like naked women.

    ~Sol

  • I like naked women.

    ~Sol

    to bad you will never get to see one IRL cause your a permavirgin

    haha, owned noob! that's how we treat noobs around here

  • how about when they're not naked?

  • Being that new-comer I ask for forgiveness for my ignorance and being in this position I honestly forgive all the a-hos if there are any (you know who you are)...love to all for all are love and loved.

  • > I like naked women.

    >

    > ~Sol

    >

    to bad you will never get to see one IRL cause your a permavirgin

    haha, owned noob! that's how we treat noobs around here

    What are you talking about? I see you naked all the tim... oh wait O.o

    madster

    No

    ~Sol

  • hello, like the most famous expression we often said in french "Faite pas la guerre, faite l'amour".

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