Petition to change Construct3 subscription payment

If someone is still using CS6 for their artwork because they don't want subscription and don't need certain new features and don't want to be locked out, that's fine.

So what's stopping them from still using C2 then? Nobody is forcing anyone to buy C3. C2 would be the equivalent of CS6. And C3 would be the equivalent of CC. C2 is still a viable option for people who don't want to pay subscriptions. Why do you have to use C3? If someone really need or want the features in c3 why not just pay up if they feel it's worth it, if not stick with c2.

I'm have both Adobe CC, and Autodesk Maya subscriptions as well, because I feel the upgrade is worth it. I could still use older versions but I don't want to, because I wouldn't get the new features. I prefer to have a subscription with regular updates, fixes, new features, and extended support. Something I will never get on the older versions.

If you don't continue pay subscription, you are locking yourself out. It's not Scirra. You can resub any time you want, or need to edit you projects. I don't see the big deal about this.

Would I lock myself out from my Maya and After Effects projects? Yes.... I do that all the time, when I know I'm not going to use it for a while. But when I do need it again, I just resub and I can continue where I left off, and I automatically get the latest versions.

***Trigger warning***

Reading through the thread again I just get the feeling people don't understand upkeep and the costs of continued development by moving c3 online and adding online build service, or is just ignorant, or stingy. Like there's a lot of people who want C3 to be an all you can eat buffet just like like C2 with a one time pay. If you fall in this category, please consider to continue to use C2 instead, it's free for life and one time pay. The rest of us who believe in future Scirra products and want to support new features, upgrades, bug fixes can show our support by subscribing.

I already got about 3 years of free upgrades, support and bug fixes in C2 and I feel it's about time I chip in again. Even if I don't use C2/C3 daily or professionally I don't mind chipping in yearly, because I really enjoy using this software as my hobby, when I have time.

I think some people are trying to say you're locked out of your project entirely. That's not the case. You mainly have edit and export access taken away.

As I've said before, we're looking in to adding a special option for people who have had exported projects in the past, so they won't have to sign up for another full year just to export again or make a few quick changes. Assuming we have something like that in place, I don't think it's fair to say any work is "held hostage" either.

As I've said before, we're looking in to adding a special option for people who have had exported projects in the past, so they won't have to sign up for another full year just to export again or make a few quick changes. Assuming we have something like that in place, I don't think it's fair to say any work is "held hostage" either.

That's a nice idea.

I think some people are trying to say you're locked out of your project entirely. That's not the case. You mainly have edit and export access taken away.

As I've said before, we're looking in to adding a special option for people who have had exported projects in the past, so they won't have to sign up for another full year just to export again or make a few quick changes. Assuming we have something like that in place, I don't think it's fair to say any work is "held hostage" either.

That should ease users who want to patch, tinker old projects. I'm looking forward what you'll come up with.

So what's stopping them from still using C2 then? Nobody is forcing anyone to buy C3. C2 would be the equivalent of CS6. And C3 would be the equivalent of CC. C2 is still a viable option for people who don't want to pay subscriptions. Why do you have to use C3? If someone really need or want the features in c3 why not just pay up if they feel it's worth it, if not stick with c2.

I agree with your argument. But I think the main problem here is that serious developers want to have full control over their project. And Scirra needs those serious developers to keep the engine rising. I'll hope the solution Ashley posted above will solve this issue.

I agree with your argument. But I think the main problem here is that serious developers want to have full control over their project. And Scirra needs those serious developers to keep the engine rising. I'll hope the solution Ashley posted above will solve this issue.

I don't think they are targeting "serious" developers. I'm assuming "serious" means indie or more professional? I think they are obviously targeting mostly children with their website. Scirra said they had success offering subscriptions to schools, so I'm guessing that's the main reason they want to test this new subscription model more widely. This is the direction they seem to be going. More focus on schools and children. That seems to be their niche market.

And maybe that's for the best. How many serious developers are drawn to making HMTL5 games? Most of the people here that say they are serious developers are actually wanting to target other platforms. Maybe an HTML5 game engine isn't best suited for that?

I don't think they are targeting "serious" developers. I'm assuming "serious" means indie or more professional?

C2/C3 is clearly built for those who don't have any prior knowledge of coding but want to get started with games. How serious people are is not measured by their coding ability. C2\C3 is just a tool like any other, just specialized for those who don't know any traditional coding language.

It's targeted to solo/duo/very small teams who want to do games without any prior coding knowledge. If you already had a coder in your team I'm pretty sure you would chose another tool unless you really looking for the ease of use of the event sheet.

"Professionals" (if you meassure it in code ability) their javascript coders could be attracted if they felt that making their own plugins gave them enough flexibility, since construct is pretty much built around the event sheet with no other way to input code. So the attractiveness for professionals is probably more relying on what the SDK/runtime will allow you to do.

Just look at plugins like Q3D and Babylon, all the rex and rojo plugins and others. A good coder can extend the use of C2 dramatically. The average Joe here, no. Most of us probably chose Construct, because we don't code, not because were not serious about our projects.

On this moment I am following a spaceshooter tutorial and create it first in Construct 2 when that is finished I will create the same spaceshooter in Construct 3. Just to compare the two.

I already tried things out in Construct 3 and I like what I see, despite a few bugs I came accross.

I also switched off the internet modem while working with Construct 3. I did not see any difference. In fact this was my main concern because when I am in Botswana, it is possible to have no internet for 2 or 3 days.

I am satisfied with Construct 3 while I agree there are many improvements and new features possible in the future. I am sure over the coming year or so, we will see many new feautures added.

I never believed the hostage/locking out stories flying around here. They found their source from the unclear communication in the past before the beta was released. However the Scirra team made it clear, that taking hostage/locking you out is never going to be happen.

The first year subscription is 50% for license holders, after that it will be 99 USD for one year. If you divide that by 12 months, you come on something more than 8 USD a month. If I understand correctly there will even be a monthly subscription costing 12,99 USD. I think the subscription model covers everybodies needs.

Threads like this, changing the subscription model, or calling for a complete Construct 2 boycot are very much pointless and a waste of time. I for instance, will buy a subscription from the moment it becomes available.

There is so much positivity here on the forum towards Construct 3. People creating excellent tutorials which we can follow. I do believe when you create a good game, you can earn money using Construct 3!

You only need the right spirit and attitude.

Chris

Im thinking a good compromise would be 30 hours full featured free use per year for anyone, new comers and lapsed subs like.

This would be far better than a cut down demo for new comers allowing them to get familiar enough with the tool to make an informed choice to sub. It would give C2 veterans and lapsed C3 subs the reassurance that they would not be held ransom to sub just to make a small change to games previously developed in the tool. Which, in a weird reverse psychologically twisted way, would mean they are actually more likely to sub.

Also I would like to add that, everything digital, at least front end, is moving (abet lowly) towards web based and online. In that respect Scirra is presently ahead of the curve. Although large data may still be moved around discreetly there will be no more programs or apps to download and install. People will expect things to be instantly available through some online portal ( browser or other). Anyone who doesn't prepare for that now will be left obsolete or playing catch up. And we, as Construct developers, can rest assured that our creations will be compatible with this future.... Im happy to sub for that.

I'm actually starting to come around to the idea of subscriptions. Well, obviously I don't like it! Who does? But consider this: C3 and it's editor is designed to run on tablets and smartphones. Tablets and smartphones can't replace traditional dev platforms like PC's and Macs of course, but they can be a very nice supplement to them. Test out ideas, fix bugs etc in spare moments on the sub, plane, whatever. And being able to access projects easily between your smartphone/tablet and your main workstation pretty much necessitates some kind of cloud service. Which costs money.

So after thinking it through I get the vision, and I sorta agree with it even if I could do with just a regular C2 upgrade myself.

How about?

Enterprise edition= 99 a year, full access, unlimited exports.

Single project= pay per event, billed at the end of each month for additional events, exports cost extra.

-If you decide to stop paying for extra events, it reverts to a free type version where you can only have the amount of events you have paid for.

Reasons to sub:

Scirra supported exporters

Improved workflow/editor elements

Runtime update, when it happen - This will probably be the biggest reason to use C3 over C2, when they get implemented

Able to work on mobile/linux/mac

If these are of no use to you, then purchase C2, which is and will remain a one off payment, or use other software, of which there are plenty of alternatives. If you have checked out the alternatives and are still here complaining about the price, then you are simply justifying the fact that Scirra has something worth paying for.

Regardless of how you want to define "locked out", it does suck that you will not be able to edit your C3 projects after your subscription expires, with no way to export to C2 besides manually recreating the project. To update a project after a subscription expires would require another year. Monthly access, perhaps at a higher price rate, could alleviate this. Or it could only be for previous subscribers if the worry is that people will create projects in C2 to export in C3 (which doesn't seem like too big a deal to me if they did buy C2 after all, which is more or less equivilant to a year subscription in C3). I imagine monthly price would be in the $20+ range, which would probably kick off another round of complaining. It shouldn't be too difficult to implement though.

How serious people are is not measured by their coding ability. C2\C3 is just a tool like any other, just specialized for those who don't know any traditional coding language.

I might add: .. or don't have time to develop using traditional coding, since the event system is way faster.

Single project= pay per event, billed at the end of each month for additional events, exports cost extra.

It's like paying for minutes using telephone services. Or if you'd pay per minute (or level) in World of Warcraft. A terrible idea in my humble opinion for a development environment.

It's like paying for minutes using telephone services. Or if you'd pay per minute (or level) in World of Warcraft. A terrible idea in my humble opinion for a development environment.

Except you keep the minutes you've already paid for.

It's not a recurring charge.

You get x amount of time to add events, in addition to the free 40.

At the end of x time you pay for the extra events. No matter what, you own that many events to do what you want, whenever you want, as many times as you like, up until you add more events than what you have paid for in the next payment period.

You would then be billed for those extra events.

If you choose not to pay for them then it works like the free version.

If you want to add any events at that point then you would either pay for the current bill, or remove some events that you have already paid for.

Like paying for minutes, those events would have to be reasonably priced in order to keep people interested.

I would add that the amount of events can be drastically reduced by using plugs.

Plugs that can be shared, or sold to the community.

I might add: .. or don't have time to develop using traditional coding, since the event system is way faster.

Yeah that too. I think the main selling point of Construct is the event sheet. Everything else is secondary. That's why we are all here. From advanced users to beginners, it's comprehensible and easy to use, yet pretty flexible. Maybe not the most powerful, but it gets the job done quickly, without too much headaches. I've tried coding, using state machines and other methods, didn't even get near creating anything resembling a game. Lol..... For me the event sheet alone is Well worth a sub in my opinion. Without it I probably wouldn't be making any games at all.

I will be glad to pay the subscription fee. It is worth it.