Let's talk about Gamedesign!

I didn't want to be an ass or something, I just think it'd be an interesting study. I'm not a huge fan of unfair passages in games, yet there are thousands of people buying games like Megaman on day one - so it'd be fun to know how people perceive unfair passages that you can only pass using trial and error, especially if you give them two variations, one where it happens and one where it doesn't.

Nothing personal here, I still love you, I just think it'd be interesting to get peoples opinions on this, cause I could of course also be totally wrong about this. That's why we have this nice forum here, to discuss shit like that

You can just make a poll thread if you want. Make a few choice options, like;

I like games that are:

A - Super easy, I feel like Rambo, I like to win win WIN!

B - Medium to Hard difficulty, where I will only die from lack of skill

C - Insanely hard, where you will die if you do not posses ESP or a time travel machine

Then let people vote.

~Sol

How about making the games you want to play, your pretty much guaranteed that at least someone will like it.

Screw conformity, screw formulaic design, the context of your presence suggests that's not what you want any way.

thomasmahler, you said games are not entirely regarded as an art form yet, but it is none the less, and as an artist, you should ask yourself "who do I create art for". When you who that is then you will know who you want to make games for.

since you're interested in the relationship of gameplay & narration, there is a rather interesting thesis about that. sadly, it is written in german and i could not find a translation. on the off-chance that you can read that language, i'll still post it: it's Britta Neitzel, "Gespielte Geschichten" http://deposit.ddb.de/cgi-bin/dokserv?idn=970619278

I have read the opening post and wanted to reply, without first reading all replies.

If my message is repeating things that been said already, please forward me back to this topic to let me read all replies first (which I will do after this reply anyway).

In my opinion:

Games can offer amusement like, for example "Horde" in Gears Of War (no story), or very story-driven. Or a mixture of this.

If the story is important, to the creator, don't let the player die too often. It can distract the player from the story.

(gears of war 1 and 2 have a mild story-driven game. There's a (enjoyable) story, but it is not intense, like for example Silent Hill, or Condemned.)

Also, in general, repeating the same things as a player, in intense story driven games, more than 4 or 5 times, is arguably old fashioned and for me a waste of my time if I want to continue with the story.

(If I want a challenge, I change the difficulty to "hard") Prince Of Persia, for example, doesn't let the play die. I like that, personally.

And about linear gameplay: doesn't matter, with intense story driven games.

Tons of good games that are linear.

A movie is not interactive like a game, but people are used to linear storytelling.

Note: perhaps contradictions can be found in my message, but creating (something/a game) deals with making decisions, making concessions. I think I wanted to make that clear.

Games have to throw surprises at the player, take resident evil 4 for example. Resident evil 4 was one of the best story driven games i have ever played. IMO it achevied a perfect balance of unfairness, gameplay, and storytelling. RE4 had sections in it where a button (or button combo) would flash on the screen, requiring you press it, or you instantly died or got seriously injured. The game forced you to pay attention to cutscenes, because you COULD ACTUALLY DIE IN CUTSCENES! The cutscenes in that game were amazingly well thought out, i actually fely like i was watching movie at times. The game was FILLED with unfair and nearly impossible sections, but thats what kept me playing. I actually like dying by surprise in games, it adds more depth and gameplay value for me. As alot of people on this thread have been saying, most new games spoonfeed you the game. I hate that. The Twilight Princess was ridiculously easy, i didn't die once during boss battles! how is that fun? A BOSS is supposed to be difficult, and supposed to satisfy you when you finally beat it (be it by luck or skill). I hate being told what to do in games, and thats why good "classic style" games are becoming few and far between. Anyone who hasn't played RE4 should definately give it try. Having played games all my life, i know a classic when i play one. I stand by my word that RE4 is a masterpeice, and infinitely different than it's predecessors.